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What are your objectives of a health care system

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wayward1 15
UnbeatableSoup 11
jackass 4
AwesomeTattooedDragon 5
It is I WhyWhyWhy 1
Dorothy Parker 3
SagaciousSighFiGurl 1
BuiltinTX70 2
sdanielmcev 23
Four Pinocchios 2
Emperor of Kingwood 46
Judas 2
the Markster 32
Prolix Raconteur 2
AMDG 64
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fuzz81 5
Karras 18
urabunchcats 18
JustWatching 28
Tryingto 22

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AMDG --- 11 days ago -


Name one anywhere in the world that has the same population numbers and demographics as the US.


This one is like deja vu all over again.

Your point doesn't diminish the fact that they do exist, seem to do a better job on many parameters than we do - and it makes little sense to me to dismiss them out of hand. Just maybe we could learn something from them - 

Emperor of Kingwood --- 11 days ago -

Your point doesn't diminish the fact that they do exist,

Yes, when you compare apples to oranges. 

Emperor of Kingwood --- 11 days ago -

seem to do a better job on many parameters than we do

Like what? 

AMDG --- 11 days ago -

cost, quality of care, Rx costs, according to the stuff I have looked at. 

AMDG --- 11 days ago -

Emp - the main part of single payer systems that I think we need are government price controls on services -

somewhere back in this thread I went down this road. I am a free market guy, and I can't believe I would see any benefit in government price controls - direct or indirect, but I think they are needed

To me the skyrocketing cost of care - due to no real market forces are the core problem with our system. And I don't see a doable market solution.

Someone going in for say an arthroscopic ACL surgery is looking at $10 - 15,000 for a routine 15 -20 min surgery - and maybe 1 night in patient.

There is something broken there - 

wayward1 --- 11 days ago -

I had my ACL repaired in Kingwood in 2004 for a mere $25,000+ 

sdanielmcev --- 11 days ago -

On a side note, my mom swears people paid cash for medical bills when she was growing up in the 50's and insurance was pretty much catastrophic.?

Your Mom is right. And even well into the seventies. Health insurance in your job is a very recent phenomenon, and really wasn't de rigueur until the late eighties. 

Emperor of Kingwood --- 11 days ago -

There is something broken there -

Its called competition and supply and demand. Costs can be reduced by placing caps on tort law settlements.

The government role should be in creating competition by promoting and (yes I say) funding education expenses for medical personnel. Government could also do a lot in reducing red tape and useless regulations. 

sdanielmcev --- 11 days ago -

t I think we need are government price controls on services -

You should really research why the costs are so high. Malpractice insurance is a biggie. As is all the paperwork for insurance and governmental intrusion.

From healthline.com -
The ratio of doctors to other healthcare workers is now 1:16, up from 1:14 two decades ago. Of those 16 workers for every doctor, only six are involved in caring for patients?nurses and home health aids, for example. The other 10 are in purely administrative roles. 

AMDG --- 11 days ago -

You should really research why the costs are so high. Malpractice insurance is a biggie. As is all the paperwork for insurance and governmental intrusion.

what exactly did your research show as the primary reasons for the escalating costs of healthcare ?? 

urabunchcats --- 11 days ago -

"The other 10 are in purely administrative roles."

Largely attributable to GOBERMENT's involvement in our healthcare system. 

AMDG --- 11 days ago -

Largely attributable to GOBERMENT's involvement in our healthcare system.

actually Urabunch one of the main advantages to single payer systems is an estimated 25% reduction in administrative costs. 

Tryingto --- 10 days ago -

Largely attributable to GOBERMENT's involvement in our healthcare system.


I think long time physicians will point to managed care, insurance and lawsuits as major tipping points in the problems with healthcare. 

Emperor of Kingwood --- 9 days ago -

actually Urabunch one of the main advantages to single payer systems is an estimated 25% reduction in administrative costs.

Cost to whom? All it does is shift the cost, the work still remains.

Plus, I don't want the government having access to my medical history. 

sdanielmcev --- 9 days ago -

what exactly did your research show as the primary reasons for the escalating costs of healthcare ??

Non-medical. Insurance and governmental regulations. 

sdanielmcev --- 9 days ago -

actually Urabunch one of the main advantages to single payer systems is an estimated 25% reduction in administrative costs

Do you have any evidence of this? In terms of real income? 

AMDG --- 9 days ago -

Cost to whom? All it does is shift the cost, the work still remains.

Plus, I don't want the government having access to my medical history.

actually Urabunch one of the main advantages to single payer systems is an estimated 25% reduction in administrative costs


This is an estimated number I have seen - it comes from not having the admin cost of processing multiple insurance claims - with just one main insurer -

no clue if it would or would not happen - just pointing out that reduced admin costs are generally thought to be an advantage of single payer 

AMDG --- 9 days ago -

Non-medical. Insurance and governmental regulations.

How on the insurance ??? If the point is they are not exerting enough price pressure on providers - I agree

can you explain "governmental regulations" way too vague to have an opinion on that one. 

wayward1 --- 9 days ago -

"The other 10 are in purely administrative roles."

Largely attributable to GOBERMENT's involvement in our healthcare system.?


Good lord, no. It has to do with the fact that hospital networks operate like small cities and need everything from janitorial, food service, security, A/P, A/R, management, marketing, PR, communications, HR, procurement, I could keep going on. 

urabunchcats --- 9 days ago -

Does anyone here seriously think the GOBERMENT can do anything more efficiently and more cost effectively?

That is 100% pure fantasy. 

Tryingto --- 9 days ago -

Does anyone here seriously think the GOBERMENT can do anything more efficiently and more cost effectively?

I never heard my father, a die-hard Republican, a serious bill watcher and critic, complain about Medicare. Why are there so few complaints generally, and why is this apparent non-capitalist health "care" program okay with Republicans while a universal program not?

Why doesn't regular health insurance have supplemental insurance to assist with costs? Or is there one to help with the high deductibles? 

JustWatching --- 9 days ago -

AMDG --- 2 days ago - quote - hide comments
Emp - the main part of single payer systems that I think we need are government price controls on services -


Gov't controls of prices don't work. They tried that in Obamacare and it's dying. If a company can't make a profit then they won't provide the care. What we really need is a free market competition type of care where companies have to compete for your business. Gov't intervention never works.

If you are really interested in a single payer system provided by the gov't maybe you should look at the VA Hospital system. That's a single payer system. Guys are dying waiting for care. Are you sure you want to get the gov't involved? 

Tryingto --- 9 days ago -

maybe you should look at the VA Hospital system. That's a single payer system. Guys are dying waiting for care. Are you sure you want to get the gov't involved?


Again, why does government sponsored care work in Medicare but not VA care?
I believe VA hospital care is only for VA's..so the audience is limited to VA's who by sheer numbers are not going to be enough to force change or support costs. A vet with $$$, or a job, will probably opt for care beyond the VA sponsored hospital sites....correct? 

JustWatching --- 8 days ago -

Again, why does government sponsored care work in Medicare but not VA care?

Because the VA hospitals are gov't run....owned by the gov't. You really don't want this kind of care. Medicare pays your own doctor. Once the gov't is the only game in town watch what happens to the rules. When the gov't gets involved the rules will change. Look at what the gov't did in Great Britain with that sick baby. 

JustWatching --- 8 days ago -

I believe VA hospital care is only for VA's..so the audience is limited to VA's who by sheer numbers are not going to be enough to force change or support costs. A vet with $$$, or a job, will probably opt for care beyond the VA sponsored hospital sites....correct??

You missed what I was saying. The VA is a type of single payer and guys are dying waiting to get care. The veterans are just a small group compared to the general population. If the gov't can't take care of a small group how will they be able to handle the general population. 

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