Kingwood Underground
the heart and soul of our Kingwood, Texas family
Login - Create Account - Help
Clean out your garage on Kingwood bookoo! Or find local garage sales on Yard Sale Search.com
KU Live!

When Iran Gets the Bomb

who's talking here?

randyjet 10
SoupIsGoodFood 14
RiteWingKing 8
AwesomeTattooedDragon 5
steinhoister2016 5
Emperor of Kingwood 6
the Markster 5
Butterbean 1
RayofHope 3
Eclipse 7
alldayredux 2
Vespers 1
fuzz81 2
Aridrodent 6

     » send to friend     » save in my favorites     » flag dangerous topic flag as a dangerous topic

RayofHope --- 3 years ago -

Encouraging a terrorist country with a long history of murdering Americans to develop a nuclear program is not what the American government should be doing.

1) Iran pays a bounty for killing Americans. The Sunday Times (UK) reported in 2010, that Iranians are paying bounties to the Taliban to kill American soldiers at the rate of $1,000 per dead American and $6,000 for each American vehicle that is destroyed.

2) Four Americans are still in Iranian jails.

3) The deal with Iran preserves Iran?s ability to produce as much nuclear fuel as it wishes after year 15 of the agreement.

4) The deal provides funding for nuclear weapons (Imagine us helping fund Hitler as he prepared for war).

5) Throughout negotiations, Iranian leaders continue to call for death to America (Big Satan) and Israel (Little Satan).

Chamberlin took a similar approach in dealing with Nazi Germany, but where will a nuclear Iran take the world? 

SoupIsGoodFood --- 3 years ago -

Only time will tell.

Given Iran's track record. It won't be good. 

RiteWingKing --- 3 years ago -

Iran is a member of the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. That will always stay in force. This new agreement is for additional protocols on Iran.

You need to also consider the decision tree on the agreement.

What are the alternatives? 

steinhoister2016 --- 3 years ago -

(Imagine us helping fund Hitler as he prepared for war).



Do some research (Prescott Bush) and you'll see just how much we DID help the Nazis... 

AwesomeTattooedDragon --- 3 years ago -

There were many- in and out of the gov't- 

AwesomeTattooedDragon --- 3 years ago -

That doesn't make Iran any less of a threat, though- 

steinhoister2016 --- 3 years ago -

There were many- in and out of the gov't-


My point is that we have a looonnng history of aiding our enemies.... 

AwesomeTattooedDragon --- 3 years ago -

Yes, we do- so this isn't surprising, just disappointing- 

steinhoister2016 --- 3 years ago -

Yes, we do- so this isn't surprising, just disappointing-


What's even more disappointing is that our "enemies" have their reasons to be our enemies...maybe we shyould stop patrolling the world and fix a few roads at home. 

Aridrodent --- 3 years ago -

Y'all are thinking about this the wrong way.

You're all short-gaming it.

We don't care if Iran has the bomb... heck, Best Korea has the bomb and if those psychos can be contained, who can't?

Plus...14 Ohio Class SSBNs and 4 Ohio Class SSGNs and 12 Virginia Class subs (with 6 more on the way) that can pack Tomahawks - which CAN carry a 150kt nuke.

So even if Iran gets a bomb (and let's say it's like Best Korea's - about 12-24 kt), we seriously outmatch them.

Everyone gets all upset about the whole "death to America" b.s. but so what, it's a game in that part of the world..everyone hates on us. Big deal. but do you know what the most smuggled items into Iran are? American Products, starting with Coke and Pepsi. The Iranian government hates us, the Iranian people want to BE us.

But let's say we lift the sanctions, give them some money. What are they going to do? Well, their immediate threat is not the U.S., it's ISIS. They fund Bashar al-Assad to fight against the rebels and ISIS. (and who so far has been the most effective force against ISIS in Syria? IRAN) MAYBE they give some money and weapons to the Kurdish Peshmurgha, the OTHER effective force against ISIS.

WE can't do it, it's politically unfeasable. The message right now is "DO SOMETHING ABOUT ISIS, but don't use our troops!" And Iran owes us for taking out Iraq and making them a bigger player in the region. We SHOULD play on that (behind the scenes of course, covert negotiations).

I have no opinion on the deal itself, I've not had time to read it - but I have downloaded it. I just know that it's better to restrict Iran for the next decade, and reduce their ability to produce nuclear material (and it does, it takes away more than 1/2 their centrifuges) and provides a clear inspection regime (and we've been able to detect minute quantities of nuclear material from the Air since the 1950's)

Side note: Did you know that 100% of all aircraft arriving from international flights are scanned for nuclear materials - we've been doing this since 2007 (look up "Domestic Nuclear Detection Office"). We have the ability to do that now.

So I'm not worried about Iran having a closeted program any more than I worried about the USSR having one under the SALT treaties in the 80-90's.

What did Reagan say? "doveryai, no proveryai" Trust but Verify. No reason not to apply the same logic to Iran. 

Aridrodent --- 3 years ago -

What's even more disappointing is that our "enemies" have their reasons to be our enemies

With Iran it's even more pronounced...Maybe we shouldn't have run the 1953 Coup, overthrowing a democratically elected, but unfriendly government, and installing the dictator Mohammad Reza Pahlavi in its place?

EVERY single one of our problems with Iran stems from that incident.

http://nsarchive.gwu.edu/NSAEBB/NSAEBB435/ 

SoupIsGoodFood --- 3 years ago -

So even if Iran gets a bomb (and let's say it's like Best Korea's - about 12-24 kt), we seriously outmatch them.

They don't care about that. Once they get the bomb and unleash it on Israel................ they could care less what happens then. As long as they bring about the end of days. (According to them). 

steinhoister2016 --- 3 years ago -

They don't care about that. Once they get the bomb and unleash it on Israel................



0 

RiteWingKing --- 3 years ago -

Just think Iran is going to get 140 Billion to fight ISIS. 

SoupIsGoodFood --- 3 years ago -

Steiny.......... You do know what Iran's stated goal with Israel is? Don't you? 

Aridrodent --- 3 years ago -

You know what the problem with getting the bomb is?

You suddenly realize you can never use it.

I.E. India/Pakistan. 

SoupIsGoodFood --- 3 years ago -

I.E. India/Pakistan.

They're not motivated to use it. Iran is. 

steinhoister2016 --- 3 years ago -

Steiny.......... You do know what Iran's stated goal with Israel is? Don't you?



Not really, I pay attention to AMERICAN problems... 

Aridrodent --- 3 years ago -

Here we go.

http://www.fpri.org/articles/2009/03/role-nuclear-weapons-international-politics-strategic-perspective 

Aridrodent --- 3 years ago -

They're not motivated to use it. Iran is.?

Now who's being oblivious? 

Aridrodent --- 3 years ago -

Just cause it's not in the MSM doesn't mean it's not happening.

India and Pakistan have been in a warm war for years now over Kashmir.

http://www.voanews.com/content/india-pakistan-trade-jabs-on-islambads-growing-nuclear-arsenal/2711216.html

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/pakistan-needs-short-range-tactical-nuclear-weapons-official-says/

NOTE: Pakistan can nuke Israel any time it wants...and hasn't done so. It's because, as I said above, these are STATUS weapons, not military ones. 

SoupIsGoodFood --- 3 years ago -

Not really, I pay attention to AMERICAN problems...

How naive. You don't think international problems can become American problems?

How "Chamberlain" of you. 

SoupIsGoodFood --- 3 years ago -

Now who's being oblivious?

Obviously, you.

How many times has Pakistan or India threatened to wipe Israel off the face of the earth? 

SoupIsGoodFood --- 3 years ago -

these are STATUS weapons, not military ones.

What status does Iran need to attain by acquiring a nuke? They're not threatened by anyone in the area. 

randyjet --- 3 years ago -

Encouraging a terrorist country with a long history of murdering Americans to develop a nuclear program is not what the American government should be doing.

THAT sure did not stop REAGAN from negotiating with Iran to keep American hostages until after the elections. Nor did it stop him from selling ARMS and spare parts to Iran. I guess that you want to deny history or falsify it by forgeting about the IRAN-CONTRA scandal. It sure did not trouble him one bit even after Iran's proxy blew up the Marines in Beirut. 

SoupIsGoodFood --- 3 years ago -

You had to go back 30+ years to pull that one out. 

RayofHope --- 3 years ago -

The White House after the press conference announcing the deal with Iran giving them the go-ahead to produce the bomb. 0 

randyjet --- 3 years ago -

You had to go back 30+ years to pull that one out

How about making a rational comment, but that is beyond your ability I see. You have to also remember Reagan also claimed to be negotiating with MODERATE Iranian leaders! By the way, he got nothing for his efforts except a Congressional investigation of dealing with terrorists he said he would never do. He also mandated that US allies do NOT do as he did.He also cared NOTHING for those dead Marines. 

randyjet --- 3 years ago -

I see that Ray is far more informed than the US nuclear experts. I have seen no opponent thinks that the Iranians can build one now. But if they try, the rest of the world will put back sanctions and cut off their oil sales. If the US rejects this deal, then it will be the US ALONE trying to put sanctions back on. Think that will work? Or the other alternative is to declare WAR on Iran and invade since that is the only way to make sure they will not build one. I hope you are willingt to send yourself or your kids to war. Iran only has 80 million people, and is larger than Iraq with more resources and even worse terrain. 

Vespers --- 3 years ago -

Ray - LIKE! Run for VP - you already have the KU Liberals on the run.

RayofHope --- 3 years ago -

This is one of the few times in history that Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Israel are on the same side. They all agree that allowing Iran to go ahead with a nuclear weapon is a horrible idea. Studying history is suppose to avoid mistakes like this. 0 

AwesomeTattooedDragon --- 3 years ago -

Indeed. No one trusts Iran- except Obama. 

RiteWingKing --- 3 years ago -

Indeed. No one trusts Iran- except Obama.

In the same way that Reagan "trusted" the Soviet Union. 

randyjet --- 3 years ago -

Obama trusts the Iranians the SAME way that Reagan trusted the Soviet Union. Of course, UNLIKE REAGAN, Obama did not and will not be illegally selling them arms AFTER they killed 300 US Marines.I see that Reagan fans spit on their memory! The FACT is that the agreement freezes Irans nuke program for at least a decade, and with the depletion of their nuclear fuel stockpile makes it even longer. You cannot make a bomb that quickly given the fact they need a lot of U-235 and plutonium. The US nuclear experts know FAR more about this than any person here. You get convince nobody by lying about the proposal since it does NOT allow the program to go on now.

If the desire is to stop Iran from making a nuke, apart from this, the ONLY way to do it is to declare WAR and invade. Think we can do that? It would be far more feasible to invade North Korea. 

the Markster --- 3 years ago -

Obama did not and will not be illegally selling them arms AFTER they killed 300 US Marines.I see that Reagan fans spit on their memory!

Who knows why our KU right-wingers keep dropping that fact like it never happened. 

AwesomeTattooedDragon --- 3 years ago -

You don't find it odd that other Arab countries and Israel are so concerned about this? They're the ones at risk, here- 

SoupIsGoodFood --- 3 years ago -

LOL @ the folks who actually trust the Iranians NOT to cheat on this deal.

You guys seriously think they aren't going to cheat? 

the Markster --- 3 years ago -

They're the ones at risk, here-

I don't know if that question is directed at me, but I'll take that one.
The Arab countries and surrounding area should be concerned. At the same time Peace in the Middle East IMO is more likely if more than one country has Nukes. Just like with the U.S. and Russia.
Israel has them. We have them. Who doesn't have one? 

RiteWingKing --- 3 years ago -

You don't find it odd that other Arab countries and Israel are so concerned about this?

They have every right to be concerned.
You may never be able to obtain the ultimate solution without war.

It is costing China Billions per year to maintain these sanctions. If China and other countries start to trade with Iran then the sanctions are greatly diminished.

Iran could end up having no Inspections and minimal economic consequences if this deal doesn't go through.

Besides the real question is what is in the best interest of the United States of America. 

randyjet --- 3 years ago -

Besides the real question is what is in the best interest of the United States of America

The oppomnents of this deal care nothing for the interests of the USA, only that of the GOP and Israel. Obama makes a major mistake in thinking that these folks care for the nations interest. The case of the USS Liberty is a perfect instance of how Israels interests trump US interests and LIVES These people throw away the lives of 20 US sailors and one ship, Liberty, and 300 dead Marines 

page 1 2
Login to add your comments!

see more discussions about...

politics


Online now:
hit counters

Terms of Service - Privacy Policy - Ice Box

Kingwood Underground